Beyond Sunday Worship

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May 22 2025

#357: The Separation of Church and Concert with Andy Cherry

Today’s conversation is with my friend Andy Cherry. Andy is a Worship Leader, former Worship Pastor, Songwriter with Capitol CMG, and touring bandmate with Brandon Lake.

Andy is mega talented and a thoughtful voice on the tensions of worship and industry. As a professional songwriter, he’s someone whose livelihood is connected to the worship industry. We have a great chat about excellence culture in the church. Has it gone too far? Why it’s uncomfortable to combine the words “worship” and “industry”.   Why we need to expand the kinds of leaders we hire into Worship Pastor roles. At the heart of it all is a love for Jesus, a passion for His presence, and a desire to serve the people of God through honest art and biblical faithfulness.

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Written by David Santistevan · Categorized: Podcast

May 14 2025

#356: Christian Nationalism and Worship: Faith, Politics, & Identity with Dr. Lester Ruth

Today’s conversation is with Dr. Lester Ruth, a research professor of Christian Worship at Duke Divinity School. If you go back in the archives you’ll see I interviewed Lester and Swee Hong Lim around the time they released their book A History of Contemporary Praise & Worship. Lester is a worship historian. The subject of this interview is about Christian Nationalism and Worship, a new course that Lester has been teaching.

I wanted to interview Lester about this because I believe it has so much relevance to our current political climate, the church, and our worship practices. Now…I know anything political tends to bring out some tensions. And this may cause some frustration for you. But the goal here is not to be partisan or take sides. We’re merely looking at the history of Christian nationalism today and even around the world. We talk about the three strands of Christian nationalism in the US today. We talk about the intersection of worship and christian nationalism and how that influences the kinds of songs we sing. We also talk about how we can have healthier dialogue together, no matter our political differences. We even end the podcast with some Civil War history and Lester’s reading habits/suggestions.

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Written by David Santistevan · Categorized: Worship Leaders

May 07 2025

#355: How Industry And Christian Product Has Influenced Worship in the Local Church with Andrew Osenga

Today’s conversation is with Andrew Osenga. Andrew is an artist, songwriter, producer, musician, and author. He used to do A&R with Integrity Music. Used to have a band called The Normals. Was a part of Caedmon’s Call. Has a host of solo records and albums. He’s a very thoughtful voice in this space of worship and spiritual formation. He leads a project called Anchor Hymns. This was a deep, far ranging conversation.

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Written by David Santistevan · Categorized: Worship Leaders

Apr 25 2025

#354: Leading Teams and Leading Worship in a Mega Church with Jordan Howerton

Today’s conversation is an interesting juxtaposition to last week’s podcast with Jason Houtsma. Jason leads worship in a church of less than 100 people. Today’s guest – Jordan Howerton – is the Worship Pastor for one of the largest churches in the country – Christ’s Church of the Valley in Phoenix, AZ.

If you’ve listened to the my podcast for a while, you’ll know I don’t believe bigger is better. There is beauty in small. There is dignity in serving and pastoring a small church with incremental or slow growth year after year. But for today, I want us to dive into the mega church dynamic.

  • What does it take to lead a staff of 70 people in worship and production?
  • How can you care for and pastor hundreds of volunteers?
  • How do you develop a unified worship culture across 18 campuses?
  • We dive into all of that here. My conversation with Jordan Howerton 
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Written by David Santistevan · Categorized: Worship Leaders

Apr 17 2025

#353: Small Church Worship, Click Tracks, & How Anyone Can Make a Worship Album with Jason Houtsma

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Written by David Santistevan · Categorized: Worship Leaders

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